My thoughts on KLG2

[meret.livejournal.com]

(I was spoiled for KLG2 with less than 24 hours to go by a fic that had no spoiler or ep warning on it. I'm still upset by it.)

What I loved:
I knew she was pregnant!!! *g* So the cylons want to create a human/cylon hybrid to be closer to God according to Boomer. I don't remember if it's apocrypha or actually in the Bible, but the cylons remind me of the story of Lucifer and the other angels being kicked out of heaven. They refused to worship humans as God ordered, saying that they were better, more perfect and holy than humans so why should they worship them. God kicked them out of heaven for their disobedience. If they cylons believe that humans are God's favorites, even though they are more obedient, I can see them being jealous, and deciding to make themselves more human with hybrids in order to win God's favor.

I *loved* that three women were chosen to save the fleet - Boomer and Racetrack by Adama, and Kara by Roslin. :)

"We love you Sharon." - So creepy! *g* I guess cylons only wear clothes for protection against the weather since the humanoid cylons on caprica wear clothing, but the Sharons on the climate controlled basestar don't. (LOL! Imagining Baltar's reaction to being captured by 30 naked Sharons. *g*)

I'm so thrilled Lee chose to follow the law, and in the end couldn't participate in a military coup.

Gorgeous music in the temple scene with Baltar and 6.

What I liked:
Is this the first time we see 6 wearing white?

I liked Baltar laying in the grass in a crucifixion pose.

I wouldn't be at all surprised that Adama knew or at least suspected that Boomer's GSW was a suicide attempt rather than an accident. By choosing her, he was giving her a way to possibly end her life for the greater good - an honorable death.

I liked the raptor as a trojan horse, and Racetrack's immediate assurance to Boomer that she would leave if Sharon wasn't back in 5 minutes. *g*

What I didn't like:
Kara wasn't coerced. She decided she agreed with Roslin. *Big difference.*

Why would Helo want to keep a baby that's half cylon? Why wouldn't he see it as an abomination? A monster? I'm projecting here, but if someone told me I was carrying a baby that was half machine from a race of machines that had destroyed my world, I couldn't get rid of it fast enough.

What I hated:
Adama had *no* authority to arrest the president just because he didn't like what she did. Is he planning on arresting Kara when she gets back too? He's breaking the law by staging a military coup. He wouldn't have hung up when she mentioned the press otherwise, nor would Lee have tried to stop it. By his actions and words, Lee confirms that, (agreement or no agreement), what Adama is doing is against colonial law. Not to mention they ended up not needing the raider to destroy the basestar anyway. I haven't liked Adama since he illegally closed the civilian board of inquiry in Litmus as soon as they dared to question his actions. I wish he wouldn't survive the gunshot wound, but I'm sure he will. That's the part I was spoiled for, so that had no surprise for me unfortunately. :(

I can't believe Laura betrayed Lee like that on Colonial One! He's risking everything for her, and this is how she repays him. No wonder people don't like her. (At the moment that's put an end to my Lee/Laura feelings.) Poor Lee! Everyone ends up betraying him - Kara with Baltar, his father by breaking the law, and Laura by not supporting him when he was trying to help her. *pets Lee*

*pets Lee some more*

Umm, what was I saying? Oh yeah, what I don't understand is how people can not like her, and still like Adama. If for no other reason than to make him eat crow, I hope she's 100% right about the arrow. He's the first character on the show I can say I hate.

Adama's such a hypocrite. He doesn't want Lee to follow *his own* instincts. He wants Lee to follow *his* (Adama's) instincts. He just wants his son to be a miniature version of him.

Miscellaneous:
Poor Crash. He's too green for this. ETA - Though with a call sign like Crahsdwon he should have know it was coming. ;)

I wonder if the cylon part of Boomer jammed the release mechanism on the raptor? I also wonder if the Sharon who shot Adama was the same Sharon who left, or did that one stay behind on the basestar?



*off to see if the podcast is up yet*

Comments

[taffetadarling.livejournal.com]

It seemed to me that Adama was far more willing to forgive Kara for her "act of mutiny" than his son. Both Kara and Lee did what they thought was right and I hope that the storyline will play out with Roslin and Adama learning from the younger generation.

Pets Lee some more, too.

[meret.livejournal.com]

It seemed to me that Adama was far more willing to forgive Kara for her "act of mutiny" than his son.

ITA! It will be very interesting to see what he does to her when she returns.

Both Kara and Lee did what they thought was right and I hope that the storyline will play out with Roslin and Adama learning from the younger generation.

June can't get here fast enough. :)

[see-tree-me.livejournal.com]

I think Adama caught the 'code' lee had sent him (saying he was following his instincts) and just hadn't had a chance yet to talk to him. If he thought Lee was really mutanying, he'd have been in the brig. I think Lee putting a gun to Tigh's head was the only way to get the president to come to her senses.

[meret.livejournal.com]

Have you listened to the podcast yet? RM has some interesting comments about the scene where Adama congratulates Sharon.

[see-tree-me.livejournal.com]

No. my computer doesn't have speakers. Is there a transcript somewhere?

[meret.livejournal.com]

Not that I'm aware of. I would post and ask if anyone knows of one. Sorry! If you email me, I'll tell you what I was referring to for that scene though. I'm at meret@illuminatedtext.com

[meyerlemon.livejournal.com]

Please point me to this fic so I can go yell at the writer.

PLEASE. I've had a rough week! I need to yell!

[meret.livejournal.com]

I'm going to write them and see what they say first, but thank you. I really appreciate it! :)

[meret.livejournal.com]

I hope we both have better week next week. *hugs*

[zorb]

I *loved* that three women were chosen to save the fleet - Boomer and Racetrack by Adama, and Kara by Roslin. :)

I had the thought as Starbuck and Six were beating each other up that this episode was very much driven and carried by the women. To which I say, hell yeah.

I was thrown by Helo's protective jump, too. I hope we see more explanation/resolution of that in S2.

The whole two-parter was about both Adama and Roslin making bad decisions, as Lee put it. I still like both of them because of their depth and complexity, though I wish they would pull their heads out of their butts and cooperate rather than antagonize. There are bigger threats than each other out there, kids!

I didn't see Laura's actions as a betrayal of Lee, though. He already put himself way out of line with that move, and he knew it - and that was what brough her to capitulate and avoid bloodshed. I have to wonder if part of his motive was to get just that to happen, and I think she folded more in his interests than hers. He pointed out to her just what she was doing by setting herself against the military, and what that would lead to.

Podcast has been up for a while - definitely listening on the second round through!

[meret.livejournal.com]

I had the thought as Starbuck and Six were beating each other up that this episode was very much driven and carried by the women. To which I say, hell yeah.

Damn straight! :D

I was thrown by Helo's protective jump, too. I hope we see more explanation/resolution of that in S2.

I'm glad it wasn't just me.

The whole two-parter was about both Adama and Roslin making bad decisions, as Lee put it.

Good point.

He already put himself way out of line with that move, and he knew it - and that was what brough her to capitulate and avoid bloodshed. I have to wonder if part of his motive was to get just that to happen,

I don't think he expected her to do that. JMO

and I think she folded more in his interests than hers.

I think it was probably her objective to avoid bloodshed, including Lee's. I'm just not sure I think it was the right move, either stratgically or politically. Letting the military commander arrest the president because he doesn't agree with what she did seems like a very bad precident to me.

[meret.livejournal.com]

and I think she folded more in his interests than hers.

That should have been italicized in my comment above.

[littlebutfierce]

i, too, was annoyed w/helo's "no, wait, we can't kill boomer, she's PREGNANT!" 360 turn. it didn't seem realistic to me @ all... one minute he's enraged that she's a cylon, & suddenly it's okay, because the baby is half helo's? bah. i didn't buy that @ all.

[meret.livejournal.com]

I'm glad it wasn't just me who had a WTF reaction.

He and Kara were cute when they saw each other. :)

[littlebutfierce]

He and Kara were cute when they saw each other.

totally! but i foresee all kinds of awkwardness if/when helo returns to the galactica next season... earlier this season, the olympic carrier was destroyed because it had been accidentally left behind w/the cylons. what will everyone think of helo, who has somehow miraculously survived on caprica all this time?

especially once people realize it was a cylon who helped him do so AND helo is suddenly protective of her because she's pregnant (which maybe he won't reveal right away? after a while it'll be obvious). or maybe sharon will get whisked away somewhere by six or by some other mechanism & helo will urge starbuck not to mention sharon or something? eh, that's a little far-fetched--but it would make helo's sudden healthy return to the galatica even more suspicious. which could be fun. ;)

& now what role will baltar (w/six's prodding) take in boomer's pregnancy? as a scientist & the designated cylon expert he might be expected to meddle or analyze or something.

hm... i'm waffling... but what else to do til july? ;)

[meret.livejournal.com]

I hadn't even thought they might think Helo was a cylon. Great call! :)

[paraxdisepink.livejournal.com]

What pissed me off (more) about Roslin is that she had to wait until her "man" (son or crush) stood up for her before she would consent to arrest. And then she had to get uppity about it. Ack, smack her.

[meret.livejournal.com]

It was definitely a sudden turn around on both she and Lee's part!

[morwen_peredhil]

I *loved* that three women were chosen to save the fleet - Boomer and Racetrack by Adama, and Kara by Roslin.

I know! I also loved that for them it was no big deal.

I'm projecting here, but if someone told me I was carrying a baby that was half machine from a race of machines that had destroyed my world, I couldn't get rid of it fast enough.

I'm with you on the "destroy the abomination" thing.

Poor Crash. He's too green for this.

At least he was smart enough to listen to the chief.

[meret.livejournal.com]

I'm with you on the "destroy the abomination" thing.

I would think that would be the prevailing opinion if Helo somehow convinces Kara to take Sharon to the galactica with them too. Either that or let it be born and then study mother and child in lab.

At least he was smart enough to listen to the chief.

Definitely! I hope he makes it back to the galactica and the woman who's interested in him gives him lots of TLC. :)

[kiaforrest.livejournal.com]

"I can't believe Laura betrayed Lee like that on Colonial One! He's risking everything for her, and this is how she repays him. No wonder people don't like her. (At the moment that's put an end to my Lee/Laura feelings.) Poor Lee!"

I think - one viewing only - Laura thought she was preventing his Death, or many deaths. I think she expected a stand off, moments to deal & negotiate and to make Tigh pause and think. Adama wanted to negotiate with Zarek - he's not 'normally' unreasonable. If she could hold out until after the basestar mission was accomplished; Adama would have a bit of time to rethink the issues and ways out of his actions.

Lee jumped in before she got a word out and with everyone Armed and in flak jackets BUT the people in front of and behind her... I can see her saying, Woe! hang on. Let's let this play out withOut anyone getting hurt.

Poor Lee is right, if he'd spoke up before or taken Adama or Tigh aside instead of jumping in to detail the security on Colonial One and giving Adama the impression he Fully supported this action... he might not be in chains and everyone would have been at a standoff until July .... I was surprised by what he did - thankful but surprised, because he appeared to me to believe 'storming Colonial One' was a Plan worth investing in.

[meret.livejournal.com]

i>Laura thought she was preventing his Death, or many deaths.

ITA about her motives! I'm not sure what she did was the best way to go about it though.

If she could hold out until after the basestar mission was accomplished; Adama would have a bit of time to rethink the issues and ways out of his actions.

Good point. I'm not sure Tigh would have ever let that happen though. I think Lee may have stopped Tigh to prevent a shootout. If she hadn't given in, then they could have had time to discuss things with Adama without a horrible precident being set. JMO

if he'd spoke up before or taken Adama or Tigh aside instead of jumping in to detail the security on Colonial One and giving Adama the impression he Fully supported this action... he might not be in chains and everyone would have been at a standoff until July

You may be right, but I think Adama was so furious, he would have had Lee, or anyone else, arrested who opposed him even before the squad left galactica.

[kiaforrest.livejournal.com]

You may be right, but I think Adama was so furious, he would have had Lee, or anyone else, arrested who opposed him even before the squad left galactica.

ITA here. BUT, the 'statement' this made would have been Adama's FIRST pause, it might have given Tigh pause before leaving. Gaeta's shaking his head, D is visibly shaking. I've been hearing about Kara's blind faith - Roslin's blind faith... Adama's demanding blind faith from everyone, President, Pilots, Son... and condemning the actions of someone who reasoned through the Possibility of what the arrow might lead them to or away from. It is so Frakking Groovy to watch the tug and pull of these two characters and how they stretch to almost breaking but it's like, ya know they won't break. They may fray, unravel and need to be reknitted but they're Not collapsing ... would that we could always know this of ourselves!

[meret.livejournal.com]

Absolutely! The wonderfully three dimensional characters are why I love this show so much! :)

[telepresence.livejournal.com]

I simply think Helo loves Boomer, and has loved her for a long time, since well before the attack and stranding on Caprica, and subconciously he's gathering that Boomer isn't following her script very well at all, that things are complicated, and that his "you aren't real/you're just a machine/you're not sharon" rant from last week mostly came from his feelings of betrayal and shock.

[meret.livejournal.com]

Perhaps the comment about the baby was meant to shock us, just like Sharon shooting Adama was.

[selenak.livejournal.com]

Laura did what she did for Lee. Because this Adama versus Adama fight WOULD have ended in bloodshed, and she didn't want to put him in a position where he would have to kill his father's best friend, and possibly others for her. Not to mention that Tigh would have given the order to fire, his own lifte threatened or not. There was no way this situation would have ended unbloody the moment Lee pulled his weapon, UNLESS she surrendered. I must say, I was with her all the way through this episode, and yes, Adama had no right to stage a military coup.

[kiaforrest.livejournal.com]

He might have had a Right (I'm not sure enough about the Colonial structure things yet) but no Reason.

Just because you CAN do such a thing doesn't mean you Should do such a thing

[selenak.livejournal.com]

True.

[kiaforrest.livejournal.com]

You have the most Gorgeous Icons!

[selenak.livejournal.com]

Made by kathyh, who deserves the praise.

[meret.livejournal.com]

Laura did what she did for Lee.

My L/L shipper heart really likes that reasoning. :)

I must say, I was with her all the way through this episode, and yes, Adama had no right to stage a military coup.

I was FAR angrier at him than her. I haven't liked him since Litmus.

[cydniey.livejournal.com]

i also wonder if starbuck's mini meltdown was not knowing if helo was a cylon, especially with the way he protected sharon. she's really left hanging without a clue to what is real. her life just got really complicated.

[meret.livejournal.com]

I loved her reaction there! She's had a hard day. *g*

[kiaforrest.livejournal.com]

and to the thought of a Cylon / Human Child?! No more, that's it. Guts of a Cylon Raider, Running off for an Arrow, Cylon's beating you up who know your name & why you're there - but THIS... ohmigosh... too much, overload, zoink.

[sizequeen.livejournal.com]

Both Roslin and Apollo made what the considered to be reasoned decisions designed to preserve order. Apollo didn't help her because he "likes" her and Roslin didn't betray her "relationship" with Apollo when she ordered him to relinquish his weapon.

Military vs. civillian action is incredibly dangerous and damaging to the society but military vs. military vs. civilian order is much, much worse. It's civil war and that's what Roslin saw when Lee pulled his gun on Tighe. She called Adama's bluff and he called hers. One of them had to stop before an all out internal war began and Roslin had the guts to be the one to do it.

Neither Adama nor Roslin is the "bad" guy here. They are both reasonable, tough-minded people who are doing what they believe is best for the fleet.

[meret.livejournal.com]

One of them had to stop before an all out internal war began and Roslin had the guts to be the one to do it.

Absolutely!

Military against civilian is civil war too. I never thought Lee helped Roslin because he liked her, but because a military coup was illegal. That's my problem with Adama in this ep. If he had gone through the necessary steps to have her impeached I would have been okay with it. Lee is right though. I've forgotten his exact words, but you can't overthrow the democracy just because you don't agree with the president.

I also think anger over Kara choosing to follow Laura's plan instead of his played a part in Adama's actions.

[barrenspot.livejournal.com]

He doesn't want Lee to follow *his own* instincts. He wants Lee to follow *his* (Adama's) instincts. He just wants his son to be a miniature version of him.

You said it. Couldn't agree more. Adama's one of my favorites, but he totally wants Lee to just be him. Which is exactly what "A man isn't a man until he wears the wings of Viper pilot" means...he's still sending that message: be just like me, or you're not really a man, you're not really my son. He doesn't know or understand Lee at all, and his main "fatherly" impulse is to try to make Lee think he should do whatever he says.

Adama's not a bad man, but he is a bad father. He can redeem himself, but it sure won't be with KLG 2.

[meret.livejournal.com]

Which is exactly what "A man isn't a man until he wears the wings of Viper pilot" means...he's still sending that message: be just like me, or you're not really a man, you're not really my son.

I'd forgotten about him saying that about the wings. Thanks for reminding me! :)